friends, dato, and tansri,
we reach the end of surah luqman.
we have a choice of listening to shaykh tawfique chowdhury or ustaz asim khan.
i listen to both.
chowdhury at [ 41.00 ] mentioned that about 1/3 of world population are christians, 1 in 5 of people walking this earth are muslims in various forms and shapes, varying levels and levels, sufi, salafi, wahabi, traditionists, etc etc and etc,shiae, sunni....
and omg! 1 in 4 are atheists...if he include the secularists i think the figure is bigger!
a believer rides on two 'wings', the 'wing' of fear and the 'wing' of hope.
ya rahman, ya rahim, ya latiff and ya wadud are the wing of hope...ya mutakabbir, ya zaljalaliwalikram , ya malik, kahhar, ya jabbar!, the 'wing' of fear.
dr nik howk
ps: i dreamed meeting my long dead tok guru and i asked him about the present muddle and puddle,
....'demo ning baso jenih menatae tak rg'eti ugamo! ...semua,hok ngaji denga hok tok ngaji, propesar, DO, ADO, tok haking, pok mat nyadap
dok ikut machae hidung demo doh keno cucok machae lembu..'
From: Azmi Wan HamzahSent: Friday, August 5, 2016 5:33 PM
To: Nik Isahak Wan Abdullah; nadzru.azhari@gun; Wan Ariff Wan Hamzah
Subject: Re: Fw: let us get back to basic......surah luqman ; epilogue
nikhowk,chowdhury is wrong to say 1/3 of the world's population is christian.many people of christian heritage in europe openly declare themselves to be atheists and agnostics. if you were to judge the numbers on the basis of weekly church attendance, i would seriously doubt that 50% of the native population of any of the western european nations are christians. which explains why you frequently find old churches been converted to mosques after expanding muslim populations buy them over.i believe there is something of a revival of christian worship in eastern europe, parallel to the revival of islam in former territories of old russia, after years of communism where the state religion is atheism. any revival, however, will be coming from a very low base. i doubt if you can assume that 50% of the native populations consider themselves good christians; the same i suspect of the islamic revival in the stans.if indeed his estimate of the muslim population is reliable at 20% or 1.5 -1.6 billion people, i dare say the christian numbers do not exceed that. but the christians, by and large, are not inclined to view another christian of a different denomination as non-christian, thanks to a process of neutralisation of aggressive sectarian differentiation through the process of secularism. if you go by the trigger-happy way our lebais and mullahs of the muslim faith are prone to declare an individual, group or sect as beyond the pale, then the muslim population could be very small indeed!salam, azmi.
________________________________ peace!.....................................................................................ts,i cannot agree more with younobody can read people's heart even when they say they are muslim.only allah knows the exact degree of our kufrness and 'almunafikunnness', for want of better definition.and mind you ts, munafiks are placed at the bottom of the burning cauldron, lower than the atheists...along with false scholars, scholars who sell their ugama for a few ringgit, and kings, pm and dictators and sultans who are not 'adil' and 'beradab' to their raayats and themselves!
i suspect chowderhury is being quite polite and generous here.
he quotes the 'official' vatican' church figures , a combined population of both catholic and protestant.....
and yes i do agree with you ts, most christians now are non practicing...they are secular ie meaning varying degrees of 'unbelielief'ie atheistic.
i choose to agree with the lebais though regarding muslims, and i and you know this is debatable, but i will tell you why my figures are much lower than the lebais even!
my figures and estimate is probably be much lower than the lebais that most seem to look down at,.... but to be generous and politically correct,that is why i 'include, ' levels and levels' , to denote inclusiveness.... shiae and sunnis.
[ http://drnikisahak.blogspot.my/2008/05/some-more-random-thots-on-death.html ]
only god knows!
but numbers are academic ts.
in my life experience and statistics, only less than 0.1 % of muslims can do the 'menguchap' [shahadah ]at the point of their death .
from here even if one is generous one can extrapolate how many billions of us are actually muslims.
.....and that is frighteningly low.
and why not?
most of us do not want hudud, or view hudud as being promitive......we are not going to debate on this, but this is already a basis for differentiaiton.
etc etc and etc.
allah is a god of 'big pictures'! ....HE is not petty. HE only asks big questions...
"WHY, and WHY NIK HOWK you choose lord Reid over ME", HE would ask for instance,
and that would be difficult for us all to answer, coming to almost 60 years of post independence and currently standing at over 65 % malay-muslim dominance over politics in malaysia.
back to numbers ts, real muslims most probably will be much much less than the stated 1.6 billions....but 1.6 billion and growing is a nice figure to toast around in this age of muslim bashing.
..........................................................................dr nik howk
Nikhowk,
These numbers are not important to me either, but some of your readers may consider them important and deserve to have a better perspective of the reliability of chowdhury"s estimate. Mine are purely conjecture, based on random observation and experience - hardly a basis for scientific statistical estimation!
thanks for your honesty in declaring you leaned to the side of the lebais and mullahs whom I described as trigger-happy in their denouncement or exclusion of fellow Muslims. But I am disappointed all the same, that someone as bright, educated and with your exposure would not step back a little from the temptation of being judgmental over your fellow Muslims and not leave it to Allah the All Knowing. Personally, I live my life as well as I could for Allah, my fellow humans and for myself. But as my Ustaz in school reminded me years ago : masing2 jaga kubur sdiri, tak soh sibuk kubur orae!"
Back to the unimportant figures. You now clarified that Chowdhury may have rather generously combined Catholics and Protestants in his numbers. Well, that may not now be all that generous. Most Protestants and Catholics have assumed a live and let live coexistence, refraining from the exclusion rhetoric that typified historical discourse between them. It allowed for a lowering of inter-Christian tension and settlement of the Irish sectarian bloodshed. Only the more virulent form of Anerican evangelical Christianity would insist on differentiation, exclusion and condemnation.
Iraqi and Syrian societies, under the secular, authoritarian Baathist ideology, have kept Sunni and Shiah communities away from each other's throats for decades, though not necessarily freed from regime violence. To be fair, most Muslim societies have kept to tolerance and neighborliness for centuries, by and large. But the late 20th and early 21st century is typified by savagery and bloodlust between Muslim sects that threatens to outdo the excesses of Christian internal conflicts of 500 years ago. What caused the sudden exuberance of violent tendencies amongst the Muslims? American design and/or Zionist conspiracy? Or Saudi petro-dollars?
When you and I were growing up, did we ever hear from the mimbar the weekly exhortation to guard against "ajaran2 sesat saperti qadiani, shiah, etc (the etc yesterday included 'sekularisma, pluralisma dan elbigitee" and may include next week "malaysiakini, YouTube and bonsai"). Unless that apostate Obama has succeeded to swap the Malaysian religious schools syllabus or Mossad agents have penetrated Malaysian madrasahs and pondok schools, you'll have to start worrying about the third alternative as being the source of divisions within Muslim society.
Nikhowk, we have had very lively and open discussion about the introduction of hudud and where we differ on the details of readiness of infrastructure for its introduction. You dismissed my concerns as excuses; I viewed your rush as recklessness that could hurt the Islamic brand. As both of us were honest, sincere and truthful in our positions, I believe Allah will judge both of us kindly. And if we as the Ummah leave the matter of what is beyond the pale amongst fellow Muslims to the All-Knowing, Compassionate and Merciful, you can tout the 1.6 billion with less anxiety!
My prayer for your dear wife, Salam and warm regards, Azmi.
Ps.
This my long explanation of how you help or hurt a brand;
There was a news item out today about Singaporean PM's visit to Washington. The Singapore PM's wife came for a bit of rough criticism for presenting not the best example of Singaporean elegance and affluence - well, she did not quite compare with Michelle Obama in terms of poise, dress sense and presence. It later transpired that she carried a clutch-bag bought from some handicap school shop, designed and made at the Spore school. The mood of biting criticism reversed into an outpouring of Singaporean pride and support for Madame HoChing. I cannot rule out that it was not planned and contrived - you know she's a very smart woman.
Her Malaysian counterpart has been reported to buy loads of Birkin handbags from the Parisian Hermes boutique, each costing tens of thousands of dollars. Ho Ching paid sin$15 for her clutch bag that she took to meet The Obamas.
What was reported of HoChing has served the Singapore brand very, very well.
............................................................................
From: Nik Isahak Wan Abdullah
Sent: Saturday, August 6, 2016 1:13 PM
To: Azmi Wan Hamzah
Cc: Wan Ariff 2; nadzru.azhari@gunanusa.co.id
Subject: Re: let us get back to basic......surah luqman ; epilogue
Sent: Saturday, August 6, 2016 1:13 PM
To: Azmi Wan Hamzah
Cc: Wan Ariff 2; nadzru.azhari@gunanusa.co.id
Subject: Re: let us get back to basic......surah luqman ; epilogue
ts,
i dont think i am being judgemental at all ts,
when, in my frequent nightmare scenario, i often wake up with cold sweat as i dream myself as being an al munafikun. i cannot be judgmental.
let us get beyond rhetorics and not allow ourselves to be fasinated by 'small frames' and small ideas.
let us get beyond apoligising our apparent disunity and broad spectrum of belief and postures.
let us look at the big picture.
the battle in this 21st century is the battle of ideas.
we muslims have not by any means raised the bar.
our bar, ts, compared to muslims of old, has been getting lower and lower.
just look at our scholars now: before they would just be the guys who would just be fit to carry the tok guru's slippers around! now they are big time. travel business class across continents giving lectures everywhere apologising to the west!
for example, tariq ramadan was banned from entering the usa because years back he was 'slightly' independent. he has to tow the line in his thinking. now he is 'sanitised' and ok to the west.
at what price ts, you might ask?
very high one i would add.
he and his friends are going to relook and reinterpret the qur'an to bring its ' incongruence with present secular views' to some degree of 'congruency'. omg!
there is a select group of them singing this swan-song.
rather, the secularists have widened their net tending to marginalise us..
just think:
if you are a cambridge prof like tj winter and hold to the sacrosanct muslim view that lgbt is not right , you stand to lose your next tenureship in the u.
if you as a majority, in afghanistan or somalia or elsewhere, want sharia as your constitution, you get yourself talibanized and un will declare you persona non grata to the world at large.
un and usa will get a corrupted clown like hamid karzai to lord over you within a portion of the militarized enclave called kabul. elsewhere in afghanistan is talibanistan.
in the name of sanity they will bomb your homes, brand you with names and drone you to death .
fellow muslims elsewhere will be so 'dumb and stupid' by daily drummimg by cnn, bbc and aljazira,that even they would think you are 'crazy' nuts.
if you go on the pulpit and talk about the revival of the caliphate, you will be droned.
etc etc etc.
the space for good old islam is getting narrower and narrower.
but what the bloody heck!
at the end of time, this is what we should expect.
if we, present day muslims bother to take more time to know our qur'an better, and in the process leave behind our secular world viewpoint at the doorstep before the qur'an , and not laced god's divine message with our very own polluted and adulterated understanding,
.....we will come to know our din better, insyaallah..
for some it will already be too little, too late!
dr nik howk
ps: may i suggest for our next dinner meeting we meet at me'nate, just a few metres away from wardieburn camp. they serve good steak here. we can collectively drown our sorrow and anger over their wagyu beef.
i dont think i am being judgemental at all ts,
when, in my frequent nightmare scenario, i often wake up with cold sweat as i dream myself as being an al munafikun. i cannot be judgmental.
let us get beyond rhetorics and not allow ourselves to be fasinated by 'small frames' and small ideas.
let us get beyond apoligising our apparent disunity and broad spectrum of belief and postures.
let us look at the big picture.
the battle in this 21st century is the battle of ideas.
we muslims have not by any means raised the bar.
our bar, ts, compared to muslims of old, has been getting lower and lower.
just look at our scholars now: before they would just be the guys who would just be fit to carry the tok guru's slippers around! now they are big time. travel business class across continents giving lectures everywhere apologising to the west!
for example, tariq ramadan was banned from entering the usa because years back he was 'slightly' independent. he has to tow the line in his thinking. now he is 'sanitised' and ok to the west.
at what price ts, you might ask?
very high one i would add.
he and his friends are going to relook and reinterpret the qur'an to bring its ' incongruence with present secular views' to some degree of 'congruency'. omg!
there is a select group of them singing this swan-song.
rather, the secularists have widened their net tending to marginalise us..
just think:
if you are a cambridge prof like tj winter and hold to the sacrosanct muslim view that lgbt is not right , you stand to lose your next tenureship in the u.
if you as a majority, in afghanistan or somalia or elsewhere, want sharia as your constitution, you get yourself talibanized and un will declare you persona non grata to the world at large.
un and usa will get a corrupted clown like hamid karzai to lord over you within a portion of the militarized enclave called kabul. elsewhere in afghanistan is talibanistan.
in the name of sanity they will bomb your homes, brand you with names and drone you to death .
fellow muslims elsewhere will be so 'dumb and stupid' by daily drummimg by cnn, bbc and aljazira,that even they would think you are 'crazy' nuts.
if you go on the pulpit and talk about the revival of the caliphate, you will be droned.
etc etc etc.
the space for good old islam is getting narrower and narrower.
but what the bloody heck!
at the end of time, this is what we should expect.
if we, present day muslims bother to take more time to know our qur'an better, and in the process leave behind our secular world viewpoint at the doorstep before the qur'an , and not laced god's divine message with our very own polluted and adulterated understanding,
.....we will come to know our din better, insyaallah..
for some it will already be too little, too late!
dr nik howk
ps: may i suggest for our next dinner meeting we meet at me'nate, just a few metres away from wardieburn camp. they serve good steak here. we can collectively drown our sorrow and anger over their wagyu beef.
